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Keralabrethren.net: Sisters' Forum: Is it unscriptual for believer sisters to do job

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# 00027 :  Is it unscriptual for believer sisters to do job
Is it unscriptual for a believer sisters to pursue their professional career?
Post by : BS  View Profile    since : 29 Jul 2002


Reply by : Elsy Eapen   View Profile   Since : 3 Aug 2002 5:12:40 AM Close
If the bible is not saying anything aginst a woman working then why this question
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Reply by : a brother   View Profile   Since : 17 Nov 2002 11:09:03 PM Close
No one wish to comment or touch on this subject since most (95%) of their families are on Job. Why this subject is pending since July and being undiscussed?.

Personally speaking, if our family is financilly sound enough I say better not to send them for work. Normally sisters are being sent for work for their financial needs. If that area is covered why they should go for?. They can take care of the other areas where mother's attention is badly needed.
Since the new generation is focusing on their financial strength, spiritally we are getting weak day by day and thereafter the family unity will be broken and children would be totally ignored.
Try to remember our parents time and also measure the values they have given to the family and ultimately lead them towards success. No regrets. What about the present family atmosphere?

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Reply by : sally   View Profile   Since : 20 Nov 2002 3:37:44 PM Close
I am a woman and I work.
There are many reasons why I work. They are as follows, not necessarily in any order of significance:
1) I am educated and I want to put my education to use. Someone might say, well put your education to use by teaching your children. Sure, I teach my daughter and expect her to achieve a standard better than mine.
Or there might be some who would not even like the idea of girls getting higher education. Thats a different issue. I dont consider such people even human.
2) The Bible does not prohibit women from working. In fact there are lots of references that explain the worthiness of hardworking women (eg Prov 31)
3) If in the unfortunate event that the husband departs or is unable to provide for the family(death, divorce, sickness, inefficiency), it is better that the wife has the option to provide support for herself and her family
Some might catch on to the point of "divorce" that I mentioned. I know and believe that divorce is against God's word. But it does happen even among believers. But I put this in a very generic sense. I know quite a few women who are forced to work after the death of their husbands. If they were already working, that transition would not be very difficult
4) I think outside work is rightly termed "work experience". It does add a lot of experience to a person.
My work gives me a lot of maturity which I wouldnt get otherwise. I learn to meet people and understand them and work with them. I learn to behave socially rather than be locked up within 4 walls of my house. There might be some who would say that you can entertain guests at home and thus enjoy social interactions. I agree that that is possible to some extent. But when you work in a big job setting, you get the opportunity to meet a large number and types of people (not to mention the opportunity to witness)
5) Of course, I get paid for the work I do. So I am not denying that money is also a factor
6) I believe it is the decision of the family whether the wife/mother should work. If both husband and wife has/want to work, then it is upto them. I dont see any scriptural commandment to depict otherwise. Just like any decisions we make, this has to be taken prayerfully and seriously and wisely, weighing the advantages and disadvantages (or struggles and benefits and risks) of that decision.
7) In some situations, it is almost required for survival that both husband and wife work, like in the US.

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Reply by : a brother   View Profile   Since : 20 Nov 2002 11:07:02 PM Close
I don't think the jobless mothers will consider their Home as 'Lock up within 4 walls' and I believe that they always find/treat their home as a place of happiness & prayer.

I am forced to say the following:

Many of our brethren sisters want their social status and personal experience /qualification to boost up by keeping 2/3 of our time spending in Job or social gathering. Being god's children How many hours we do spend with our family together in prayer/worship. Is it not a serious issue?. No one find time for that and treat the same as secondary.
We should open our spiritual eyes and a total revival is necessary now a days.

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Reply by :   View Profile   Since : 22 Nov 2002 10:04:19 PM Close
The scriptures say that a woman is to be subject to her OWN husband. THe implication is that she is not to be subject to someone else's husband...or so I've been taught.

Comments?

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Reply by : Grace   View Profile   Since : 1 Dec 2002 3:51:33 AM Close
Excuse me the Nameless character above please understand the meaning of scriptures ....there is no subjection to someone else's husband by being a working woman.

Understand the meaning of the word SUBJECTION and what it means ... it could be the author is just intrested in writing a comment and so wishes to be identificationless. it ok but don't twist facts.

To Brother:
Yes, good about the care you have for family togetherness. But brother can you really declare on this forum that children of jobless mothers are better spiritual than the working mothers?
Brother, i can tell about more than one incident including people in Lord's full time ministry are loosing their children to this material world without their parents knowledge. Such mothers are fooled by the children and are not even aware where they are once they out of their houses.

Exceptions are if the non-working mothers are really prayerful and really mingling with their children to know their activities.

I am sure many working mothers get up early in the morning and intercede for the family.

When sisters are doing there household duties & working to pursue their respective careers by being an example to the world ... by being light of the world ... then what & where is the problem???????

I accept its challenging & nothing is our efforts but daily intercession which sustains us to do both.

God Bless to continue in prayers without falling into temptations!!!

N.B one query to all from malayalee background who now claim that women should not work . Have your mothers not being involved in household works like feeding the cattle, bringing the wood and many other such activities during your upbringing which took many hours of her day and still was she not able to manage minimum 4-5 children. Don't forget it would be her prayers in the early morning before the chores of her day started.

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Reply by : a brother   View Profile   Since : 9 Dec 2002 6:41:28 AM Close
What our mothers did in the past is within the small circle itself. But now our sisters trying to be more competant internationally. The more we are exposed the more problem arises.(v can learn many instances in the developed countries such as US/Canada/Germany/UK that women disobey husband and it endsup in quarrel/diverse etc.) Why this is common now?Frankly speaking now a days our sisters doesn't want to sit at home with the children whereas they look for fame, position and money. Where the family spiritual grade stands? I should say that mother/wife should take care of the houses, to be a model family...., same as th eolden days....Cant it be practical?
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Reply by : Grace   View Profile   Since : 21 Dec 2002 12:39:08 AM Close
Respected 'a brother',

When you read Proverbs 31 try to note down every events that are mentioned there about qualities of a good wife and try to evaluate the time taken to do an activity in those days and the current days that is why things have become international now, SIR. If you say about mothers in past working in small circle in that times then few questions how many hours did she sit besides you???????? how many times did she ask you about spiritual and educational activities???????? [Exceptional cases of mothers from high society families where they never had to do household activities might exist ]

In proverbs you see the husband of a good wife respected at the gates --- brother those days the circle was very small but know its very large -rather international as per your terms-(this is to clarify why things are on international basis in these days).

Let me tell you one cannot avoid divorces, seperations,etc by not allowing their wives to work. It seems you are afraid of your wife's sincerity. In that case brother such ladies need not go for job they can do better evil things by sitting at home. IDLENESS gives way to many worser things.
You need God's care to be blessed by a good family unity.
Sharing matters with such professional wives and praying together daily for atleast 30 min would be root cause for a better God blessed family. You can then say like JOSHUA said. Serving the LORD is possible everywhere.Doesn't full time ministry. All born again believers are bound to serve the Lord but the point is are you useful for the LORD's service in any ways????????????

But prohibiting your wives would be of no use brother. Once againg if u r intrested to understand regarding this topic 'brother' Prov 31 can really help you. please don't repeat your points again but try to study and coreleate it and bring some new points if you still can't accept the matter and that might be helpful. May God bless you.

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Reply by : Blessey   View Profile   Since : 26 Dec 2002 10:25:08 AM Close
That nameless post above referring to subjection was me. I apologize for not putting my name.

Subjection: (from www.dictionary.com): Being in a position or in circumstances that place one under the power or authority of another or others: subject to the law.

After further study, sister Grace, I think it is clear what subjection is. I think it's significant to note that the apostle Paul said it like this "subject to her own husband" instead of "subject to her husband".

Please consider and comment. Don't reject because you disagree. Please give a sound scriptural comment.

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Reply by : Blessey   View Profile   Since : 26 Dec 2002 10:26:33 AM Close
One more thing. If your boss is male, then you are subject to someone who's not your husband.
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Reply by : Grace   View Profile   Since : 28 Dec 2002 8:23:00 AM Close
Sister Blessy i appreciate ur manner of acceptance of the abv posting

Sis Blessy, such ideas regarding "subjection" as specified by you prevaileth among many, i myself was taken aback with the sort of intrepretation presented by some brethren, some time back. But then that gave me the chance to study on this topic thoroughly. Here i am also answering to few other twisted intrepretations besides the one by Sis Blessy.

I am sure though u've not mentioned the verses for urselves that u tend to use 1 Peter3:1&5 for 'subjection of your own husband'

BUT DOES SCRIPTURES EVER SPECIFY 'BE SUBJECT TO YOUR HUSBANDS ONLY'???' thats why i wrote earlier understand the meaning of 'subjection'. We need to Rightly divide the Word of God - i.e. Scriptures entirely and not a verse alone....'coz this causes us to stumble like many other denominations stumble on different topics eg. child baptism,Holy Spirit,etc...
Now,
==> 1 Cor 14:34 specifies subjection of women in the church
Does it mean only one's own husband exist in the church and there's no other man besides him in the church? OR that one husband and his wife forms the church???? Its home not church...
==> 1 Timothy 3:5,11 specifies abt children's subjection to parents
Does it mean a married daughter(wife of someone else) need not be subject to her father?
==> Romans 13:1 [LET EVERY PERSON BE IN SUBJECTION TO THE GOVERNING AUTHORITIES] KJV..mentions...Higher authorities.
Does it mean that every man in governing authority are ones own husband[s]..!!!???

THIS CLEARLY STATES THAT YOU'VE TO BE SUBJECT TO YOUR BOSS whether he/she without gender bias

==> 1Peter 3:1 states [Likewise, ye wives...] LIKE WHAT????? this with reference to above verse in 1Peter 2:21-25. (I think the problem is it was a new chapter formation from this verse...)
But on reading the previous verses its self explanatory to understand 'subjection' like what is expected and for what its expected by wives to their own husbands.

Thus bible owes subjection to earthly father, the church, the governing authorities and also to one's own husband. The first three is for all and the later is only for wives to be specific. So hope now the fact that subjection besides one's own husband is also expected in the bible.

Also i don't think you might have gone to vulgar extent of corelating working believer(born-again) sisters(wives) in aspect with 1 Peter 3:1 on the basis of Gen 3:16. And if thats ones understanding of subjection to higher authorities at workplace then there's major rectification needed in one's perception(way of thinking) about workplace and home and that too in relation with believers.

Subjection means leading a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty - thus i.e complete obedience to word of God.

Again if 1 peter 2:23-24 not clear then subjection of Christ during earthly tenure are:
-> did not revile in return (subjection to earthly authorities)
-> He uttered no threats
-> trusted in God the Father (i.e. His Father)
-> suffered for our righteousness(unselfish desire i.e. unconditional)

This shows Christ's subjection to His own Father- God the Father & In the same way [Likewise] God expects woman to be subject to her own Husband. Read further for understanding subjection of Christ elsewhere during the tenure on earth .

to be continued.....

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Reply by : Grace   View Profile   Since : 28 Dec 2002 8:25:10 AM Close
....Continuation of above posting...

A]==> The godly wife will be submissive to her husband; this submission isn't a reward for the husband's good behavior, it is commanded by God as the proper order for the home

B]==> True submission in the home follows the same principles of submission as towards government or our employers; it is a submission not only of the actions, but also of the heart - as demonstrated by the surrendering heart of Jesus (IPet.2:21-25)
i). The call for submission is not merely a call for love and considerate action; it is a call to relate in submission to authority; the term is used outside the New Testament to describe the submission and obedience of soldiers in an army to those of superior rank
ii). Yet, submission in authority can be totally consistent with equality in importance, dignity, and honor - Jesus was subject to both His parents and to God the Father, but was not lower than either

C]==> The benefit of submission is shown in the way that it affects husbands for God - a wife's submission is a powerful declaration her trust in God, an such faith can do great things, even without a word .
Peter reminds them(women) that God's plan is that wives impact their husbands not through persuasive lectures, but through godly submission, chaste conduct, and the fear of God

D]==> Of course, submission in marriage follows the same principles as submission in other spheres - our obligation before God, UNLESS ONE IS DIRECTED BY THE AUTHORITY TO SIN; in such cases, it is right to OBEY GOD RATHER THAN MEN(Acts 4:19-20)

1 Peter 3: 5
==> When women submit to their husbands, and when the do not put trust in their outward adornment, they are like the holy women of former times who trusted in God - they powerfully demonstrate their faith
i. True submission is not all about trusting the one submitted to; instead, it is about trusting God
==> Sarah's submission to Abraham was demonstrated by two things: obedience and honor; those remain as two essential aspects of submission for those who would be daughters of Sarah


On the basis of 1 timothy 2:11
(11-12) Women are to show submission, and to yield authority in the church
a. Submission is the principle; silence is the application of the principle
b. "Under authority" is the principle; not teaching is the application

i. Paul is saying that women should not be recognized by the church as those having authority in the church regarding matters of doctrine and interpretation
ii. Not all speaking or teaching by a woman is necessarily a violation of God's order of authority in the church

May God Bless thee to understand His Words in the days to come.


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Reply by : sunilajoseph@aol.com   View Profile   Since : 24 Apr 2005 2:40:19 PM Close
It is not unscriptural that ladies work. It is good and healthy if we get oppertunites working outside home. We get money too.
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Reply by : koreanorchestra   View Profile   Since : 28 Dec 2005 11:07:24 PM Close
i am a working wife - we really need the money. i am well- educated and so is my husband- but the money i bring home is very important for us.
And yet i think that my primary responsibility is to my husband and our home.
The day my husband says that our family life is suffering on account of my job- that day i will quit.
I am convinced that a good education does not necessarily mean that i HAVE to work.
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Reply by : calvinist   View Profile   Since : 12 Dec 2006 9:37:28 AM Close
I cannot find(in my little knowledge) anything in scripture that is aganist sending wives/women for a secular job.

*** But my concern in the modern society.***
1) I have seen LOT of families where the mother goes to work early morning and comes back home late evening or night. No time to look after her children or husband. What is her primary responsibility as per the scripture??

2) In cases where both husband and wife are working, there is nobody to bring up the kid. Husband will send the kid to play school or crush and wife will "collect" him/her back or vice versa. From where did Issac learned about sacrifice? Where did Timoty got the 'belief'?...

3) There are lot of cases where husbands and wife, staying in the same house, see each other once or twice in a week because of various shifts in their job. How the family will survive?

True. In our previous generation mothers did work(looking after cattle,brining wood etc), but they will be in and around their house looking after the needs of their family...praying, telling about the scripture to the children, giving the children breast milk and also brining up in nurture...

Yes...the woman can work, but should have ample time to take care of her husband and children and or the extended family.

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Reply by : mathai   View Profile   Since : 13 Dec 2006 9:45:57 PM Close
Thanks calvinist
It is mandatory as per scripture for husband and wife to live together. Br. Calvinist expressed concern about family not having time to be together and take care even though they live together. But i have found, atleast in kerala , many families where husband and wife meet each other once in 3 year / 5 years / or after a many months. Because they work in different countries, or places separated. This basically defeats the purpose of marriage itself. Many Kerala brethren are in Gulf/Abroad and many cannot afford to take family there. They lead the most miserable life on earth for the sake of some money.
I have never heard a sermon on the marriage pulpit by the solemniser or by the preacher, who categorically say - Husband and Wife should live together, at any cost. Beacuse the preachers dont have the spiritual guts to say that.
I feel, any man who feels that he cannot take the responsibility of the family to live together,should not get married and marriage in such case will be a waste and leads to all problems and even sin.
Let us teach the basic scriptural principle that Husband and Wife should live together, and cannot be separated because of job and money.
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Reply by : johnmiller   View Profile   Since : 16 Dec 2006 10:00:30 AM Close
Dear BS,

Your original question was "Is it unscriptural for sisters to pursue their professional carreer?"

The scriptures do give guidance on this subject. We do not know if Lydia was married, although it seems probable that she was either a single woman or a widow, but we are told in Acts 16;14 that she was "a sller of purple". In Acts 18:2,3 we read that Priscilla worked as a tentmaker along with her husband. Perhaps one made the tents and the other sold them.

Your brother in Christ,

John

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Reply by : calvinist   View Profile   Since : 19 Dec 2006 9:35:00 AM Close
Thanks Bro Mathai and John.
I have mentioned that, I cannot find anything aganist sending sisters for a professional carreer. I think that answers the question.

Addendum:- We Brethren people, who are having the enlightenment, have to see the scripture in the light of holy spirit. In a nutshell, before taking a decision on sending one's wife for a secular job, both have to kneel down and pray to get conviction from Lord that they are not blowing out the basic purpose of a great instituition established by our Lord himself. I welcome Bro. Mathai's comments to reinforce my comments.

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Reply by : mom23   View Profile   Since : 22 Feb 2007 4:23:33 PM Close
I have been reading the above posts and here is my thought on the original question.
I know that there have been above posts that mentioned Prov. 31 about the working woman. I truly don't think it is unscriptural to be a working woman...but like always it is your attitude that really makes the difference. In Proverbs, the woman who is honored at the gates is praised by her children and husband for the fruits of her labor. She was a woman that definetly took care of all her family's needs.
So the question really boils down to your motives behind a "working woman" status..is it to be an independant woman in your own right? For a feeling of fulfillment towards self and the education you acquired? Or is it something else?
I do disagree with a post by Ms.Sally on her reasons for being a working woman, because it seemed like a very secular outlook.
I apologize if I seem rude Ms. Sally, but to say that stay at home mom's don't get the opportunity to meet people, work with people etc. on large scales is really distorted. I am a stay at home, homeschooling mom by choice. I meet,socialize and work with so many individuals for various reasons from volunteer work, promoting , organizing events/trips etc. So in today's world socialization is certainly not restricted to "entertaining guests at home" within the 4 walls.
Also Ms. Sally it is so possible for a family, even in the US, to live with one income, but that requires priortizing what is important in the long run for the family.
And you definelty don't need big conglomerates to witness to...everything starts at home.
We often forget we have a future generattion of christians in our homes..how much scriptural values do we instil in them to be successful in their christian journey rather than focus on them being secularly successful people?
There is peer pressure to be a successful career woman, and be a good homemaker..super mom, but at the end of the day you really need to only worry about what the Lord wishes from you and not what others think you should.
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Reply by : sra   View Profile   Since : 8 Jun 2008 7:45:51 PM Close
Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from themouth of God.

Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added unto you.

Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not unto your own understanding. Acknowledge Him in all your ways and he shall direct your paths.

Our choices in life about what we do from moment to moment matter. Our life here on earth is not about survival. We are not called to comfort or tranquility. We are not called to having peace as the world would call it. we are not called to make something of ourselves or to live a satisfied life of achievement. Surprisingly, we are called to suffering. Our purpose of life here is preparation for eternity, to know our God, to understand Him, and enjoy Him. we will have trials on earth. Yet we make our choices to avoid trials. We do not want material and financial struggles so we accordingly make those choices. We don't want others to look down on us. We crave to be something. We do not have the foresight to see the next generation and their
foundation. Let us remember that it took only one generation in the story of the children of Israel for them to fall away into doing things as they thought was right. And how sad was our God!

One thing I have found helpful is to think of the only shelves of choice that I have and to place every thought and argument that causes me to rationalize my choices on either of the two shelves: God or Self. It is quite obvious to me when I do that as to what is right, because I have God's Word. Usually, the whacky idea is God's will because His wisdom is not the world's wisdom.
Education - self
Work experience, maturity, socialization - self
husband departing - leaning on own understanding - self
Empowerment - self
Financial security - self

If you make your choices based on fear of the future and to avoid trials of material, physical or emotional nature, then those are your shepherd. The Lord is my Shepherd, i shall not want.

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Reply by : sra   View Profile   Since : 8 Jun 2008 8:02:27 PM Close
If anything but His Word is my Shepherd, I will be in want and the things I fear will most likely happen for Satan loves for us to not trust God's Word, and the Lord will allow those trials as He has so much eternal purpose in mind for each of us.

I have seen lives and families that live by faith. The wives are well educated but realize that an education is always for the glory of God alone to use as He sees fit, not only for earthly remuneration. As they have trusted the Lord and poured their lives into their homes and children, constantly working towards directing their children's hearts to the Lord and His Word, God has given many opportunities for them to use their knowledge and skills as time went by, without them even struggling to do so. Those opportunities have been opportunities for ministry in awesome ways. Some have businesses from the home. In this time and age of information tech., there is no limit to what you can do from the home. In these families, i have seen them live simply and have to make sacrifices. But oh, the spiritual richness that they have. Their children are examples of godliness at very young ages. And God goes out of His way, it seems to provide for them and show Himself strong for them. What testimonies they have! Trully, I would not exchange such a life where I have the God Who tore up the Red Sea for the Israelites doing awesome things for me in every small and big matter...for temporary earthly stability. Life becomes an adventure. FAITH = Fantastic Adventures In Trusting Him. The most beautiful thing I have noticed is that they know God and understand Him and walk with Him so closely, I want that for myself. "Nothing between my soul and my Savior..."

God bless all this and you, too.

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Reply by : sra   View Profile   Since : 8 Jun 2008 8:12:14 PM Close
Dear ones,
There is also a verse in Psalms that says,"And he granted them the desires of their hearts but sent leanness unto their souls." To me that is a scary verse. To go through life here and lose the richness of knowing Him is sad. What we go through here counts towards eternity. Who knows what it all amounts to, but we do know that it all means something to Him. He is our exceedingly great reward.

sra

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Reply by : sra   View Profile   Since : 8 Jun 2008 8:15:35 PM Close
An added thought:

If the foundations are destroyed, what will the righteous do?

Please contemplate to yourselves.

sra

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Reply by : mda   View Profile   Since : 11 Jun 2008 2:48:43 PM Close
In reference to the question, there is no mention in the Bible regarding "married women working". Every person is aiming at a good education and the end result is a satisfying job. Some like to work and some don't. As a working women, we must be careful that we try to balance our work with the the household duties(spending time with husband and children and teaching children the fear of God). My mother was a working individual and so am I. Our work should not be #1 in our life.In Proverbs, the word of God gives us a lot of instruction about wise women. Give importance to the word of God and follow it. Everything else will fall in line.
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Reply by : blessyjayaron   View Profile   Since : 21 Apr 2009 9:30:59 AM Close
My viewpoint that sisters shouldnot be sent to work is wrong. But when u find that things are not going the way it shld go, family prayers are hindered,mental peace is shattered,sisters stop working. Iam a working woman as a lecturer in a college.Of course life becomes very busy but things are planned and carried out the way it should go.And moreover my edu. qualification and experience is being used in a proper way to provide financial assistance to my family. But my working is not a long term.Idon't wish to continue my job when my children grow up and attain teens because that is the age where they really need parents especially mothers guidance.
Anyway we must consider that that our profession is secondary and children family and prayer is the first priority.
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Reply by : starrynight   View Profile   Since : 23 Apr 2009 9:10:43 PM Close
Very interesting topic, one that I am sure touches at the souls of many Christian women who work.

I work full-time and am also a mother of young children. My situation is a little different from most because I do get to see my children for most of the time they are home. But still I worry all the time about bringing them up properly -- to love and know the Lord, to build good character and be good citizens. I think all moms, working or not, worry about these things too.

We live a comfortable life because we are a two-income family. I don't deny that. But in my household, money is not the first priority. Upholding a testimony as a Christian family is our goal. I don't think I am sinning by working -- God has blessed and used me in this capacity tremendously (all praise to Him) -- but as someone else pointed out, my main responsibiity is as wife and mother, and I will do all that is necessary for that. You can never let your career stand in the way of that.

I think it is a struggle for many working women, but it can be done only if the proper balance and perspective is found. The money we make is temporary, but the impact we have on our families and specifically our children has eternal implications. I think many working moms are trying their best to strike the right balance -- let's pray for them, not knock them down.

I should add that if so many men are concerned about women not working, then perhaps we need to rethink our emphasis on how we look for spouses for our children -- if a spiritual home is your main concern for your son or daughter, then look for a girl with a known testimony instead of one with a MD or MBA degree. (Before anyone misunderstands, I have no issue with girls going for higher studies. But parents should not be two-faced, only looking for wealthy, highly educated girls for their sons, and then expect them to sit at home after marriage.)

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