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Keralabrethren.net: Youth Forum: Second Marriages

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# 00083 :  Second Marriages
Hello, This is a topic which is troubling me for sometime.Bible permits second marriages after the death of the first partner.But I personally am not able to accept this fact.How can one accept another woman or man in his life when he or she had already given there heart and body to there previous partner.Will the love between the partners be sincere and true .How can one say that they loved there partners sincerly when they where alive and once they are dead there love for them and there responsibility towards family is no more.Is this not a cruelty towards there children.How can one assure that the second partner will take care of the children as there own father or mother did.Is it not selfishness.Why should one marry a second time.Is it not to fulfill the lust of the flesh.Why not rather spend rest of our lives in the ministry of the Lord.Is there no other options other than to remarry.Is Bible talking about the personal opinion of the apostle.Am i wrong if I think against the idea of second marriages.Pls comment on scriptural grounds
Post by : achu  View Profile    since : 8 Aug 2005


Reply by : brethren   View Profile   Since : 8 Aug 2005 6:44:03 PM Close
Achu - You should put this in the General Forum. I dont understand why this a discussion for Youth.

Now - Let me ask you few questions. Be Honest.

1. Are you a widower?
2. If not how this issue personaly affecting you?
3. Or is some one who is married for a second time has been a stubling block to your spiritual growth?
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cruelty towards there children - You mean to tell me - You rather see a single parent to take care of the Kids rather than both parents?
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How can one assure that the second partner will take care of the children as there own father or mother did. ???? IT MAY NOT work in the INDIAN ARRANGED MARRIAGE SYSTEM. so before the marraige the couple should discuss and come to a conclusion.
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it not to fulfill the lust of the flesh - You think being single is at more risk to have the lust issues?
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Why not rather spend rest of our lives in the ministry of the Lord.???

So you are suggesting a windower - (single parent) should just go to ministry after the death of a spouse.
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You said its your opinion and its NOT scriptural. I believe not only widower, but people are victims of innocent divorces should be remarried.
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You think we should go back to the days of sati" or self-immolation, once seen as the ultimate act of fidelity

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Reply by : sambudhanoor   View Profile   Since : 9 Aug 2005 8:48:18 AM Close
Dear Achu

Best answer of your question about the widower re-marriage is 1 Corinthians 7, it is self explanatory, there is no hard and fast rule, it is up to ones conviction.

There are lots of examples in our midst and some are staying alone and raising children, or doing God's ministry and some are re-married, this is also depending on age. (This is from the Indian perspective).

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 9 Aug 2005 9:28:01 AM Close
Dear 'achu,'

AS 'brethren' wrote, this is better discussed in the General Forum. Since you placed it here, let me say a few things.

You wrote, "This is a topic which is troubling me for sometime.Bible permits second marriages after the death of the first partner.But I personally am not able to accept this fact." I don't know what was meant by "I personally am not able to accept this fact." Are we saying this about the word of God? If so, it is very serious. If we reject the word of God because of our personal preferences, then we are placing ourselves over God and His word.

If you are saying that you don't want to remarry, then it is upto you and there is nothing in the word of God that is against your personal preferences. It is stated in 1 Corinthians 7 as brother sambudhanoor wrote, only if you want to remarry.

Shalom malekim!!!

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 9 Aug 2005 3:04:03 PM Close
Hello Brethren/George P.Koshy,
Its not a topic to be discussed in general.Its a serious topic which each and every young person should be aware of even before they end up getting married or the thought comes into the mind regarding second marriage.And there is nothing like general topic in spirituality.Every incident in a beleivers life is real serious.Can you people honestly say that you dont access sisters forum.Wherever the topic is placed it has to be discussed.Lets come to the point.One should be ready to face any challenges in life.
God gives all grace required if you are determined to put your trust in HIM and acknowledge Him as all sufficient God.
First let me answer the queries of Brethren
1. Are you a widower?
Ans:I am not a widower
2. If not how this issue personaly affecting you?
Ans:I am seeing young and old getting married again among so called beleivers for selfish pleasures and that too when situations are favourable to live even if not married again.Old persons getting married without the consent of the children thereby by breaking hearts and relations.
Believers forcing single parent to get married again even if they are not willing.
If showed unwillingness they are looked upon with suspicious eyes.
Young ladies getting re-married and not allowing there children to meet there real grandparents.
Wives who waited for there husbands to return home to have dinner together,How can they so easily forget the love and care they had towards there first husband and end up living with another man.Can the heart and mind of people be so easily changed.Will these people never have a guilty conscious.Is it not hipocracy.
3. Or is some one who is married for a second time has been a stubling block to your spiritual growth?
Ans:Yes,I cant imagine of facing a person who got recently married again.When the persons first partner was alive I had seen the intimacy they had between them.How can that person even imagine of second marriage.Is it not cheating.I cant have fellowship with such a person.
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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 9 Aug 2005 3:19:01 PM Close
cont'd
I would suggest that single parent should look after there children and try to live more closer to God the rest of there lives
Brethren suggested that innocent divorcees should remarry.Is there any scriptural evidence.Bible views this as adultury.
Sati is another form of Suicide.

George P Koshy:I am not saying that I have rejected the word of God.I am still a learner of the word of God.I wanted to clear the doubts which are there in my mind.If you cant help me then pls avoid passing comments.Can I ask you if you are strictly following every instructions as per the scriptures.I am a mere human being and not God.
I wanted to understand what apostle Paul meant when he said in I cor7:39"The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth;but if her husband be dead,she is at liberty to be married to whom she will;only in the Lord".Is this statement his personal opinion!!!!

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Reply by : sharon4christ   View Profile   Since : 10 Aug 2005 3:54:14 AM Close
Achu ,

I also feel the same as you do !!!
I've also seen few believers , who've remarried just after few months of their partners death !! :-SS

I too lack a nerve to worship & have fellowship with such people .
I dont know , that is this feeling right or not ,
but this is what i feel.

I've seen them in an intimate relationship & in a strong bond with their previous partners ....
But now i see them with their new partners !!!!!! :-O

Its just what i cant accept !!
I feel that whatever i saw before was a hypocrisy and may be a ditching behaviour !!


P.S. - Not with a motive to misbehave or hurt anyones sentiments .

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Reply by : sachugeorge   View Profile   Since : 10 Aug 2005 12:00:02 PM Close
Dear Achu and Sharon,
Was just going through the responses.. Our personal experiences plays a major role in our perceptions.Its Achu's personal -bitter- experience made her descide second marriages are bad,its cheating, its hypocratic, and also as its a means for fulfilling one's desires of flesh.I feel that we cannot generalise.
First of all the word of God allows it.Secondly a person gets maaried not only for the needs of the fulfillment of flesh.It means a lot..companionship, fellowship...

Let me tell you an incident of a beleiver Aunty whom I know. Husband died when children weer too young. She did not get married till they grow up, thinking she will be cheating her late husband and children. After her daugter got married, Son went abroad.. she left alone at her big house with a whole lot of memories.She was depressed..clinically.Please don't tell me beleivers are supposed to have communion with Jesus, thus they should not get depressed!
recently her children made her married to a person with similar past. And they are happy with the lord, with each other, with their children.
So my sugestion is, its up to a person to descide in "consultation" with our Lord primarily whether they want to get married or not. Let us not judge those who are married second time and make them guilty of what they did.
I hope that I did not sound "arguing"- a general tone of our discussions here!!
Achu would like to hear your views.
God bless you.

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 10 Aug 2005 12:04:39 PM Close
Dear 'achu,'

What we read in 1 Corinthians 7 is to those who are married. When it was about not to marry again, we read, "But this I say, as consenting [to], not as commanding [it]." (7:7)

When dealing with the questions from the saints at Corinth, we read, "But to the married I enjoin (command - KJV), not I, but the Lord." (7:10)

The verses 27 and 39 come after verse 10. It is the command of the Lord and not just an opinion of Paul, as some teach.

I don't know why we are taking a stand against what the Lord has permitted, or commanded!

Shalom malekim!!!

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Reply by : sunilajoseph@aol.com   View Profile   Since : 10 Aug 2005 5:41:21 PM Close
I agree with gpk. Why we (think who) always have a stand against the commandments that Lord has given. If you go through all threads in this net, we can see that we say NO to what God said YES and we say YES to what God said NO.
IS THAT STRANGE?

Sunila.

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 11 Aug 2005 4:08:07 PM Close
For all supporters of second marriages,
Let me ask few queries:-
If second marriage is right why is it that these marriages are done in secret.

Why is there no big celebrations as in the first marriages.

How many of you have been invited to attend second marriages?
This clearly indicates that the couples engaged in the second marriages are either doing this act with a guilty conscious or by the force of the people around.
Dont you feel its better to live a quite life,and let others live a quite and peaceful life without giving room to talk bad and not stand as a stumbling block to others willing to come to christ.Pls comment...

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Reply by : brethren   View Profile   Since : 11 Aug 2005 7:41:36 PM Close
First of all Thank you for answering my questions.

<< marriages are done in secret >> - I am not sure why would any one want to do that - But i do understand most of the 2nd marriagers dont want a big celebration, after all they are going through a period of pain, no matter what you and I think, especially when 2 widowers get married.

Now after reading your post - I feel you are frustrated by some persoanl issue. As i look among the assemblies in the US, i dont even see that many 2nd marriages, i think the brethren are blessed by the Lord with long years of marriages (happy or not).

Have you actually went and talk with this particular person and talk to him/her. May be after an open, compassionate chat with them, your attitude may change. Instead of holding on to the grudge with whoever it is, please deal with this issue.

Also, any one's second marriage is a stumbling block for some one to come to Christ is - nothing but an excuse.

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Reply by : terry_martin   View Profile   Since : 12 Aug 2005 5:18:30 AM Close
Dear Brethren,
Its very unfortunate that one loses his/her life partner at whatever age irrespective of their social/financial status. Lets not sit to judge them nor condemn them but let us try and get get into their shoes and try to understand what she/he would be going through in all human emotions.

If they personally feel that yes they need a partner then the scripture does permit it and please understand it is not forced on anyone. It is permitted not commanded. If anyone is not in favour of a second marriage then so be it but let that not emotionally derail you into stop having fellowship with those who feel necessary to remarry. Please do not judge anyone by the wealth they possess nor the children they have. Can we the married say that we still honour marriage(remain married) only because of our wealth and children? NO, its because of the life partner our Lord God has blessed us with.

To 'Achu' I would like to say, The Holy scripture does not give nor mention or share anybody's personal opinion but its all God inspired.

There are always bad apples in a basket so please do not generalise such extreme views and wrongly hurt the feelings and sentiments of such brethren who go through unimaginable pain.

'Sharon4christ' please understand that a child of God does not need a "nerve" to fellowship they need Grace Humility and Love.

UNFORTUNATE one must say to remarks such as the marriage is not conducted as grand as the first, he/she really does not need(how do you know & who are you to say that?), why am I not in the list of invitees(if I was,then accepted).

Brethren please let us not impose our likes and dislikes upon anyone nor let us restrict our fellowship with ones who are/do what we like/dislikes.

Remember we have the WORD OF GOD in our hands and the comforter always beside us to guide and make us wise.

Let us all the more love and show fellowship to these dear ones.

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Reply by : lemuelraj   View Profile   Since : 12 Aug 2005 8:24:50 AM Close
A few points to add to what has already been said:

1. We still walk in the flesh (2 Cor 10:3), and sins of the type of Mat 5:28 are possible, both for unmarried, married, and widowed people. "Now the WORKS OF THE FLESH are manifest, which are these; ADULTERY, FORNICATION, uncleanness, lasciviousness" (Gal 5:19). One has to walk in the Spirit.

2. "TO AVOID FORNICATION, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband" UNLESS it is your "proper gift of God" to stay single as unmarried or widowed (1 Cor 7:2,7).

3. Keeping our conscience and actions right with God is more important that falling in line with pseudo morality invented by people.

4. In 1 Tim 5, Paul is talking about helping widows. There he instructs Timothy to count only those who are above 60 (verse 9). As for the "younger widows", Paul suggests that they marry (verse 14), and give none occasion to the adversary to speak reproachfully. The "younger women" of verse 14 are same as the "younger widows" of verse 11. It's in the same context.

5. FORBIDDING to marry (when it is permissible by the Scriptures) is a doctrine of devil (1 Tim 4:1-3).

Moses

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 15 Aug 2005 2:19:02 PM Close
Thank you one and all for your valuable contributions and the time spend on this topic.God's word is unchanging.Our duty is to only obey what he has said.If he had said YES its YES if NO its NO.We are no one to question his rights.Second marriage is permitted in the Bible,accept it.Gods will be done in our lives.
I am sorry if I have hurt anyones sentiments through this forum knowingly or unknowingly.
I have one more request for people who are married for the second time.
I would like to here your personal experiences after your second marriage.How has it affected your spiritual life,family life etc etc.Whether it be good or bad experiences,no issues.

GOD's name be glorified

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Reply by : brethren   View Profile   Since : 15 Aug 2005 5:06:57 PM Close
Dear Achu.. My best friends spouse died of cancer, years ago. The survivor is now married.
there were no big celebration, no big invitations. just a simple ceremony. I also know of few other people who lost their spouses, from various sitations and remarried. I persoanly know how one person get attacked and slandered by fellow so called believers in various circumstances, mostly related to church politics. So, now you know why your post is intimidating to me.

Your request to know more about this subject is very curios and puzzling. If you leave your email, I will be more than happy to get in touch with few of "second married" couples.

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Reply by : joythomas   View Profile   Since : 16 Aug 2005 8:10:02 PM Close
Achu.. there are many people in the US, that are divorced and remarried and are in charge of the Local Assemblies.. how you react to that?
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Reply by : sambudhanoor   View Profile   Since : 17 Aug 2005 7:39:10 AM Close
Dear joythomas
Your quote:
"there are many people in the US, that are divorced and remarried and are in charge of the Local Assemblies.."
In charge of the Local Assemblies - Which are these assemblies?
Even gay people are became priest of the Churches?
Someone in US or any part of the world is doing something, has any validity before the living God.
Any Scriptural support to validate these peoples actions?

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Reply by : Varghese   View Profile   Since : 17 Aug 2005 9:44:14 AM Close
Quote from above: "there are many people in the US, that are divorced and remarried and are in charge of the Local Assemblies.."

Pls substantiate your statement with solid evidence, please.

God Bless!

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 19 Aug 2005 6:02:09 AM Close
Hi Joy,I fear I will lose the Joy of my salvation if I happened to go to such assemblies.I pray that I don't end up in such assemblies.... and I have the faith Lord won't put me in such places.
As Brethren has mentioned in the forum that he supported second marriages of innocent divorcees.In fact there is no scriptural evidence of second marriages of even innocent divorcees.Bible instead views this as adultery which is sin.How can such a person be in charge of the assembly.I really doubt his belief as well as the belief of the believers gathering in that assembly.I doubt whether the brother you are talking about must be a dictator like Hitler or Saddam Hussain without fear of either God or man.
Can you mention the assembly where this has happened in US so that i can conduct an enquiry if you dont mind......I Timothy 3 gives a detailed description of the qualifications of a elders and deacons.GOD BLESS U
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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 19 Aug 2005 8:29:15 AM Close
Dear 'achu,'

Please provide the verses from the scriptures that support your statement, "In fact there is no scriptural evidence of second marriages of even innocent divorcees.Bible instead views this as adultery which is sin." I am not asking about "innocent" divorcee. As a matter of fact, I don't know what is meant by "innocent divorcee." I am asking about your contention that second marriage is an adultery which is sin.

What is your understanding of "husband of one wife," in 1 timothy 3?

Shalom malekim!!!

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Reply by : sincy_varghese   View Profile   Since : 20 Aug 2005 1:00:38 AM Close
Assumption: Second marriages as a result of the death of spouses, and NOT DIVORCE.

1. As Christians all our personal opinions should be brought in line with the Word of God. We may not be able to accept certain things because our culture has conditioned us to believe so, and it will not come as a flash. We need to discipline our opinions in accordance to the Word of God. As each day goes by our faith in God’s Word as the only guide for our Spiritual life should increase. Then our opinions and life will conform to the Word of God-All this by the power of the Holy Spirit.

2. The Bible is indeed a great book of mysteries (mysteries of marriage) and devotion, but the Bible is also an intensely practical book. The study of the Word will help us do things approved of by God (2Tim2:15). So while we have the picture of Jesus Christ and His bride symbolized in marriage, at the same time, the Bible also says that “To avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife” 1Cor7:2. Similarly bringing up children, taking care of home (albeit it has become passé now that majority of (Christian) women prefer to work outside, but that does not negate God’s principles)

3. As we see in the Word of God, marriage certainly is uniting of heart, body and soul and for Spiritual people also a unity of Spirit, yet it is also one of the means God had placed in this fallen world for protection against sin. So let us be honest to accept the practical aspect of marriage. (See Ecclesiastes 4:9,10)

4. As for Sharon4Christ’s observation “I've seen them in an intimate relationship & in a strong bond with their previous partners ....
But now I see them with their new partners”. I thank God for such married couples, who have chosen to obey God’s principles for marriage than to think “what would others think of me if I am very attached to my new wife/husband” Put that opinion of man into the garbage bin and learn to obey God “Husbands love your wives, just as Christ loved the Church and gave Himself for it”.

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Reply by : sincy_varghese   View Profile   Since : 20 Aug 2005 1:02:42 AM Close
5. Achu wrote “Wives who waited for there husbands to return home to have dinner together,How can they so easily forget the love and care they had towards there first husband and end up living with another man.Can the heart and mind of people be so easily changed.Will these people never have a guilty conscious.Is it not hipocracy.” Guilt & Hypocrisy--Absolutely NOT, because the Word of God says so!!! So my opinion does not count a dime, only the Word of God!!

6. Sharon4Christ wrote “I too lack a nerve to worship & have fellowship with such people .
I dont know , that is this feeling right or not ,
but this is what i feel.”
Our feelings just does not count anything if it is against the Word of God. What God hath cleansed, call not that common. A marriage like this has been sanctified by God and nobody has the authority whatsoever in earth or in heaven to say that it is not right!! Sorry to disappoint!! NOT having the nerve to worship and fellowshipping for this reason is definitely wrong and disobedience to the Word of God (which is Sin)
7. Finally we see that there are certain traditions which we have inherited either from our forefathers or from the society are vain and we need to let go of them and hold on to the Word of God.

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Reply by : sunilajoseph@aol.com   View Profile   Since : 20 Aug 2005 5:49:58 PM Close
If you see the husband and wife united in their flesh, you may have a nerve to worship & have fellowship with such people. If you look at them with their companionship you will see it. They have both. Both is their businees.They don't have to explain it to you.

The re-marriage is after the first partners death. They were united only untill their spouse's death.

It is your eye who judge them. That is your sin.

Love in Christ,

Sunila.

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Reply by : sincy_varghese   View Profile   Since : 21 Aug 2005 2:17:23 AM Close
Sunila, Was that a refutation to my mail?

If not, please do not read further!!

If Yes, I would advise you to read through my mails a bit more carefully. Although I have tried to make myself clear, yet I feel you have not understood the stand I took. You may have made haste to read my mail or you might have not understood my post. Either way my humble advice is "Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, and slow to anger" James 1:19. I think in this context you have the liberty to read it as "Let every man be swift to understand, slow to respond and slow to pass opinions"

In Love
Sincy

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Reply by : sunilajoseph@aol.com   View Profile   Since : 21 Aug 2005 3:18:09 PM Close
sincy,

No, It was not for you. It was for Sharon. Sorry I didn't address her.

Sunila.

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 25 Aug 2005 6:01:58 PM Close
George P.Koshy,
Pls don’t raise false accusations.I never said second marriage is adultery.What I said is remarriage when one of the partners is alive is adultery against the new partner even if it’s a divorce case.
“Innocent divorcee” is the term used by “Brethren”.So he will be in a better position to explain it.If both parties are innocent there will not arise a need for divorce.
As far as my understanding is correct “Innocent divorcee” is one of the partners involved in the divorce who is innocent.For eg.Certain crucial factors like incurable illness(aids,cancer,mental illness)will be hidden from either the boys family or the girls family before the marriage.The truth will be revealed after the marriage has taken place.In that case the person from whom the truth is hidden is cheated and is the sufferer.So he is innocent.In such a situation this person can approach the court of law and file a case of divorce against his /her partner stating the reason as misrepresentaion of crucial facts.The verdict of the court will definitely support the sufferer and certify him as “innocent divorcee”.
But Bible does not permit divorce other than in the case of fornication.The words of our Lord Jesus is very significant in this context.
Mathew 5:31-32
“It hath been said,whosoever shall put away his wife,let him give her a writing of divorcemnt.But I say unto you that whosoever shall put away his wife,saving for the cause of fornication,causeth her to commit adultery and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced commiteth adultery”
In another instance we find the Pharisees asking Jesus whether is it lawful for a man to put away his wife.For that Jesus answers
“Whosoever shall put away his wife and marry another,commiteth adultery against her.
And if a woman shall put away her husband,and be married to another,she commiteth adultery”.(Mark 10:11,12)

“Husband of one wife” in I Tim :3 simply means the elder should not be the husand of more than one wife.
cont'd

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 25 Aug 2005 6:05:02 PM Close
cont'd
In the human perspective a man is free to marry another woman once he has divorced his first wife.That’s not a crime.
But in spiritual perspective or rather in Gods perspective or in the court of God “What God has joined together let no man put asunder”(Mark 10:9)

Its you and I who is to decide whom to obey whether GOD or MAN

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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 26 Aug 2005 8:12:43 AM Close
Dear 'achu,'

On 19 august 2005 I was quoting from your posting of the same day at 06:02:09. I did not say that you said it. I just quoted you.

Now, in the heat of our passion and arguement, we missed a lot from the scriptures. The second marriage is allowed in the scriptures to a widow or widower. Please read 1 Corinthians 7. If one get divorced, even if it is not his/her fault, to marry again to another is allowed only if the former spouse from whom he/she divorced was dead. That is, that person is a widow or widower.

I think, you had this in your mind, but failed to make it into the posting. I was trying to help you to bring it into the discussion, rather than a blanket statement of 'no remarriage.'

Shalom malekim!!!

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 30 Aug 2005 3:28:03 PM Close
Now another situation with respect to remarriage in scripture.In Genesis chapter 16:3 we find Abram married Hagar while his first wife Sarai was still alive.Surprise to note that this act was not considered as adultery.Was this act not a sin in those times.
Pls comment!!!!!!!
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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 18 Sep 2005 5:26:30 AM Close
Hey,why no response.Fed up of second marriages!!!
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Reply by : lemuelraj   View Profile   Since : 18 Sep 2005 8:22:04 AM Close
That was ok in the OT. Not in the NT.

Moses

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 19 Sep 2005 10:57:35 AM Close
Dear Moses,
Thats your personal opinion what does the scripture say
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Reply by : lemuelraj   View Profile   Since : 19 Sep 2005 11:31:55 AM Close
Dear Achu,

Can YOU show a Scripture in the New Testament to the contrary?

Moses

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Reply by : joyboy   View Profile   Since : 19 Sep 2005 10:23:33 PM Close
Easy explanation: Adultery was not defined until Exodus. Perhaps it wasn't adultery because God hadn't defined it yet to his people.

Just a suggestion. What do you think?

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 21 Sep 2005 6:08:27 AM Close
Hello Moses,You mean to say adultery was permitted in the old testament but not in new testament.That means there is change in the character of God.
Joyboyavid commited adultery even in his death bed.Solomon his son had 700 wives,princess and 300 concubines.If I am right this incidents happened after Exodus.
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Reply by : joyboy   View Profile   Since : 21 Sep 2005 9:34:32 AM Close
I was only talking about Hagar and Abraham.
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Reply by : lemuelraj   View Profile   Since : 21 Sep 2005 1:53:58 PM Close
Quote from Joyboy: "Easy explanation: Adultery was not defined until Exodus. Perhaps it wasn't adultery because God hadn't defined it yet to his people."

Read the case of Abimelech and Sara in Gen 20:3-7. Abimelech knows what is adultery, and he knows it is sin. And this is BEFORE Exodus. But how does he know? Easy, "For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves" (Rom 2:14). Read v.15 also.

Quote from achu: "Hello Moses,You mean to say adultery was permitted in the old testament but not in new testament.That means there is change in the character of God."

How can God permit adultery? Who told you that having multiple wives in the OT was adultery? Adultery is defined in Lev 20:10. It mean's taking someone else's wife. Taking a virgin/widow/divorcee as second wife in the OT is not adultery. You talk about David. See what God said. "And I gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom, and gave thee the house of Israel and of Judah; and if that had been too little, I would moreover have given unto thee such and such things" (2Sam 12:8).

David comitted adultery only in the case of Bathsheba, because she was Uriah's wife at that time. David did NOT commit adultery in his death bed with Abishag. Read 1 Kings 1:4.

Now here's the last one. "If a man have TWO WIVES ..." (Deut 21:15). The Law does not prohibit multiple wives.

But this is not allowed in the NT. No Christian can marry another woman while her wife is living (exepting for the exception clause of Mat 19:4). If he did, he has committed adultery.

Polyandry (having multiple husbands simultaneously) is a no-no (John 4:17-18). The New TESTAMENT started with Christ's DEATH (Heb 9:17).

Moses

Moses

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 24 Sep 2005 11:04:04 AM Close
Dear Moses,
Now one question.Why 2 rules or rather 2 laws??If marrying multiple woman was allowed in Old testament why not in the new testament after all its not adultery.Any particual reason for that.
Joyboy,I am sorry some icon popped up in between my earlier reply,it was not purposely done.
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Reply by : Philip1   View Profile   Since : 24 Sep 2005 12:19:59 PM Close
I have read most of your entries. One of the question that came up with is, How can a spouse who loved their previous spouse and have a same expression for the new spousel?

1, It is not the same. When someone looses a spouse it is very difficult to deal with. Yet one of the main thing is they took some time to accept the loss. They have worked through their loss and realize that the dead spouse is not coming back. They need to move on with their life. They choose to re-marry. This is not nyalating the previous relationship or forgetting it. It is a preparation to move on with one's life. They have to love the new spouse just as they loved the diseased spouse.

2, Friends, Relatives, and children of those spouses who have been diseased, were unable to work through their grief. The person is still alive and want this person have a loving life they once had. Now they are seeing the widow/widower with the new spouse the possiblity or the myth of having the friend, relative, or parent is dead. This causes very much of difficulty. Some times it is coplicated by position with this widow/widower. This person is no longer my frinds spouse. Fill in the relationship.

3 Part two
a, It is important that this person get married if they are young. There will be sympathy in the beginning. Yet time will pass. Every woman or man of this age person will be worried about their spouse getting close to this person. Eventually all friends and relatives in inlaws would drop out and the widower/widow will be left to deal with his/her life. They may also need help with raising children and intimacy not only physical but also emotional.

b, As you have read from brethren above it is permitted in the Bible.+

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Reply by : lemuelraj   View Profile   Since : 25 Sep 2005 12:45:18 PM Close
Dear achu,

Quote: "Now one question.Why 2 rules or rather 2 laws??If marrying multiple woman was allowed in Old testament why not in the new testament after all its not adultery.Any particual reason for that."

The Jews in the OT had to keep the Sabbath. Are you asked to do it now in the NT? No. The Jews were commanded to abstain from certain meats (like pork, shrimp, etc). If any one commands to do it now, he is teaching a doctrine of devil (1 Tim 4:1-3). There are 2 laws, 3 laws regarding many things in the Bible. The difference is in the dispensations. God chose to deal with people differently at different times.

So you cannot call an OT saint that had multiple wives as adulterer, unless he took another man's wife.

Moses

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Reply by : lemuelraj   View Profile   Since : 25 Sep 2005 12:47:32 PM Close
"Any particual reason for that."

Because, "from the beginning it was not so" (Mat 19:8).

Moses

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Reply by : davidchase   View Profile   Since : 27 Sep 2005 10:08:26 PM Close
Dear all,
I would just like to add that in dealing with such situations, sensitivity to the personal needs of the individuals concerned should be considered. God would use us to encourage, exhort and correct with love, according to His own purposes, in His own time, and contribute to the building of His body the church while waiting patiently prayerfully for His guidance. Since it is His body, He has to give us the wisdom to deal with such situations as needed.
warm christian regards
david chase
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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 2 Oct 2005 6:18:22 AM Close
Dear David
Pls clarify about which situation you where discussing. The statements seems to be very general and not to the point.
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Reply by : samiaf433   View Profile   Since : 13 Oct 2005 10:51:31 AM Close
Hi. I have read through all the messages posted here and I am quite impressed by the Questions of Achu and specially the answers by George P Koshy. Since I am going through a similar situation, i need to clarify certain points. And these i ask humbly of Bro. George P Koshy. In ref to your comments on "innocent divorcee", I have to place the following for your notice. I was married to a believer in 2000. we had a good time initially. But certain differences of opinions arose, despite our best efforts to solve it, they remained. Meanwhile, she conceived and left for her house in the 7th month. She refused to come back. My elders did their part in trying to intervene and solve the problem but they were rebuffed. Her church pastor (her father is working in Aathmeeya Yatra)intervened but to no avail. We also wrote a letter to Bro. KP Yohanan with an intention for intervening but he was too busy to deal with such small matters. I kept up my efforts to meet her. In 2001, May she gave birth to a child. I have not seen the child till now. She has refused all efforts to meet the child. She filed for divorce and got it ex-parte because i decided it was against God's will to go to "unbelievers with our problems". if she had allowed our elders of the assembly to intervene and then if it was not feasible to continue then i would have gone to court to explain my stand. I still love her despite the divorce. I am 30 yrs of age. I have if it is in His will, quite some years ahead of me.... Now brother, Do I fit in the merits of an "INNOCENT DIVORCEE"& most importantly, can I remarry..... ?
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Reply by : George P. Koshy   View Profile   Since : 14 Oct 2005 8:55:26 AM Close
Dear 'samiaf433,'

I do not give advices on personal matters to persons unkown to me. To begin with, I do not know you name. In any personal advice, the personal knowledge is essential. I am not asking for you to make your name known. I am stating my inability to advice.

Are you an "innocent divorcee?" I don't know. You have not defined the term. YOu only gave an example. My question on "innocent divorcee" was with the expectation of receiving a definition.

To ansewr your question on second marriage, please read Matthew 19 and 1 Corinthians 7. You will see the answer there. The answer is right in the word of God.

Shalom malekim!!!

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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 29 Oct 2005 3:38:36 PM Close
Hello GPK,Whoever the person samiaf433 may be,he seems to be genuine since he has mentioned names of persons like KP Yohannan and details of his father in law who is working in Athmeeya yathra.Samia,personally i feel sorry for the present state you are passing through but i would like to know what exactly was the issue which made your wife to seperate from you.Is it something related to immorality.If so there needs to be a true repentence from the side of the responsible person if there is any intention to rejoin.Since you said you still love her and you would like to reunite the best suggestion that I would give is "take it to the Lord in Prayer".As and when you get the green signal from above go ahead and convey your desire with all sincerety to your wives dad if possible.Be very frank in your approach.Analyse the area in your life whether you have gone wrong anywhere at any instance.After all we are human beings and living in a sinful world and is prone to make mistakes.As someone said "When I point one finger at any one I should be reminded that rest of the fingers are point at myself".Pray that God may give the guidance at the right time..
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Reply by : jpdobcofjc   View Profile   Since : 17 Nov 2005 12:13:45 AM Close
"Achu": why would "samiaf433" have to approach his father-in-law in order to convey his desire(s) to his wife? Why not approach her directly? Of course, she may not listen to him but incorporating in-laws into such situations could make matters worse.
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Reply by : achu   View Profile   Since : 1 Dec 2005 12:59:21 PM Close
Hello "jpdobcofjc ",As you rightly said samia's wife may not listen to him so the best way is to approach to his in laws or any one of his wives relatives in order to solve the issue.
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Reply by : ifellinlovewithamalayalee   View Profile   Since : 22 Oct 2011 9:00:33 PM Close

vows in wedding says : till death do us part. so, it's possible BUT

consider people around you =) like kids. they deserve to say something and not just agree to the parent's decision.

if a true flesh and blood [arent sometimes loses control and get angry...and pissed off in kids.. how much more those that are not real flesh and blood?

 

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Reply by : paulthomas1   View Profile   Since : 24 Jul 2012 6:42:59 PM Close

 Dear Moses: I read this thread today and got confused on one topic:

"There are 2 laws, 3 laws regarding many things in the Bible. The difference is in the dispensations. God chose to deal with people differently at different times."

Sabbath or restrictions on food were directions given to Jews, but if something is a sin in the NT won't it be a sin in OT too, since GOD's attitude towards sin does not change with time? 

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Reply by : svarg   View Profile   Since : 1 Aug 2012 6:46:22 PM Close

 Now for the matters you wrote about: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.” But since sexual immorality is occurring, each man should have sexual relations with his own wife, and each woman with her own husband. The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body but yields it to her husband. In the same way, the husband does not have authority over his own body but yields it to his wife. Do not deprive each other except perhaps by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control. I say this as a concession, not as a command. I wish that all of you were as I am. But each of you has your own gift from God; one has this gift, another has that.

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